Wednesday, January 2, 2013

Ye Olde Grammarian, No. 3: Pesky Punctuation Problems

       In her peregrinations around the blogosphere and the self-publishing community, Ye Olde Grammarian has noted some anomalies in the use of certain punctuation marks that she felt ought to be addressed.  They involve the use of commas, periods, colons, semicolons, and question marks when combined with quotation marks and parentheses.  There are lots of websites out there where these rules are addressed, but still people seem to be confused.

Where does one put the closing punctuation when quotation marks are used?  Is it inside or outside the quotation mark?
 
Periods and commas always go inside the quotation mark, whether it's single or double. 
 
Correct:  He said, "I won't be home until evening."
Incorrect:  He said, "I won't be home until evening".
 
Correct: He said, "I heard her say, 'There's no one here.'"
Incorrect:  He said, "I heard her say, 'There's no one here'."
Incorrect:  He said, "I heard her say, 'There's no one here'".

Question marks can be tricky (the same rules apply to exclamation points).
 
Correct: He said, "When can I come home?"
Incorrect: He said, "When can I come home"?
 
Correct: Did I hear him say "I'm not coming home"?
Incorrect: Did I hear him say, "I'm not coming home?"
Incorrect: Did I hear him say, "I'm not coming home."?
[In this case, the whole sentence is a question and the quoted part is a simple declarative sentence, so the mark goes outside the quotation mark.  The third example demonstrates that you don't duplicate punctuation.]
 
BUT ...
 
Correct: I heard him say, "Aren't you coming home?"
Incorrect: I heard him say, "Aren't you coming home"?
Incorrect: I heard him say, "Aren't you coming home?".
[Here the whole sentence is a declarative statement, but the quoted part is a question unto itself, so the mark goes with the quotation.  And again, you don't duplicate punctuation.]
 
Colons and semicolons go outside the quotation marks. 
 
Last year about this time I was engaged in copyediting a novel for someone and in the process I double-checked things I wasn't sure about. That's when I discovered this rule.  I confess I had always thought semicolons went inside the quotation mark and had always used them that way in my writing.  I had never thought about colons, since that situation would occur rather infrequently.  Anyway, I know better now and here are my examples:

Correct: I suggested he use the common name "Mary"; he refused with a scornful twist of the lip, remarking, "You have no imagination!"
[Note that the exclamation point goes inside the quotation mark because it pertains only to the quoted sentence.]
If the sentence had read like this, with a comma instead of a semicolon, the comma would go inside the quotation mark.
Correct: I suggested he use the common name "Mary," but he refused.

Correct: pai| is the Shshi root for "war." "Warrior": pai'zei|; the noun "fight": pai'zi|; "battle": pai'pai'zi| (literally, "fight among many")
[This second example is similar to material in the footnotes from my "Labors" series.  You can imagine how much difficulty I had copyediting them!  Getting all those colons and semicolons and quotation marks placed and spaced right was devilish, to say nothing of keeping the italics consistent!  And note that I omitted a closing period because the succession of words is not a complete sentence.]

The same basic rule applies to parentheses that applies to quotation marks.
 
Correct: After we went to bed (and there was really nothing else to do), a storm came up.
Incorrect: After we went to bed (and there was really nothing else to do,) a storm came up.
Incorrect: After we went to bed, (and there was really nothing else to do), a storm came up.
[Since the parenthetical material belongs with the opening subordinate clause, you don't set it off with an initial comma.]
 
Correct: After we went to bed, a storm came up (hadn't I said it would?)
Incorrect: After we went to bed, a storm came up (hadn't I said it would)?
Correct: After we went to bed, a storm came up (and it was a real thunder-boomer!)
Incorrect:  After we went to bed, a storm came up (and it was a real thunder-boomer)!
[In these two examples, the question mark or the exclamation point pertains only to the clause in parentheses.]

Never duplicate punctuation.
 
Incorrect: After we went to bed, a storm came up (hadn't I said it would?).
[If a mark of punctuation is used inside the closing parenthesis, you don't add a period at the end.]

Correct: I wrote a long term paper (actually, it was a bit too long).
Incorrect: I wrote a long term paper (actually, it was a bit too long.)
[Here, the parenthetical material is treated as part of the basic sentence, so the period comes outside the closing parenthesis.]
 
Correct: I wrote a long term paper. (Actually, it was a bit too long.)
Incorrect: I wrote a long term paper.  (Actually, it was a bit too long).
[If the parenthetical material stands alone, place the punctuation within the closing parenthesis, just as you would with quotation marks.]
 
Are you thoroughly confused?  I know I've managed to confuse myself!  But I think I know these rules and apply them automatically.  If you want to see an expert's simpler exposition, go to http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/quotes.asp 

9 comments:

  1. Thank you so much for this, Lorinda. I'm bookmarking it for future use.

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    1. Thanks, Corinne, I'm glad somebody is getting some benefit from my grammar posts! This one struck me as becoming more and more confusing as I continued to write it!

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  2. I liked this post! Now I know I've been doing it right all along (but I don't do the : or ; with quotes, wasn't familiar with that one).

    Thanks, Lorinda!

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    1. Again, I'm glad some of the grammar stuff is proving useful! I've been surprised lately when I see well educated people putting the period outside the quotation mark. The colon and semicolon get less use, but occasionally the semicolon placement in particular does come into question.

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  3. I really enjoyed how clear and understanding this is. This is a common issue that comes up in my writing and it's comforting to have something to fall back on.
    So thanks! I'll keep and eye out for more grammar posts!

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    1. Glad it's proving useful! You can access my earlier Olde Grammarian posts by clicking on "Grammar" in the labels in the sidebar. The first one dealt with dangling participial and prepositional phrases and the second with correct usage of pronoun cases.

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  4. Perhaps the best test of correct usage is when you read something and instinctively go 'Ouch!' But you're not sure why. Of course, we can have real fun with nested quotes: "He said: '"That's right," she told me.'" Logically, one should put the full stop at the very end of that sentence, but it wouldn't feel right.

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    1. Yes, that nested quote is knotty, isn't it? But you still wouldn't duplicate the period. One does it. How about this (using American style quotes)? "I said, 'Did he say "That's right,"' or did she tell me,'He said,"That's right"'?"
      Is anywhere close to right? LOL
      By the way, your 'Ouch!' makes it clear that it's "Ouch" that is the exclamation. If the whole sentence were the exclamation, then it would be 'Ouch'!

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  5. Of course, the quote marks are packed so tightly together in these examples that nobody can tell a double from a single one! I'm tempted to follow James Joyce, dispense with the comma before a quote mark and replace the open quote mark with a ~ Or perhaps we could revert to medieval usage and use some curious mark of our own invention¿

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